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Hall of Fame baseball writer Hal McCoy has retired from the Dayton Daily News after covering the Cincinnati Reds for 37 years. Hal's blog, though, will continue to be a must-read for Reds fans. He'll share his thoughts on the team this season and will file updates from Great American Ball Park. You also can catch Hal in print every Sunday in his popular Ask Hal columnHome > Blogs > The Real McCoy | Cincinnati Reds baseball news > Archives > 2011 > December > 23 > Entry
Are the Reds trying to go ‘all-in’ in 2012?
IF THE CINCINNATI Reds were playing Texas Hold ‘Em, it would appear that they are going all-in.
General manager Walt Jocketty made his second trade in a short few days and once again acquired a pitcher for multiple players.
This time the Reds plucked left-handed relief pitcher Sean Marshall from the Chicago Cubs for left-handed starter Travis Wood and two minor-leaguers, outfielder Dave Sappelt and infielder Ronald Torreyes.
Late last week, Jocketty obtained right-handed starting pitcher Mat Latos for four players — starting pitcher Edinson Volquez and three high prospects in Yonder Alonso, Yasmandi Grandal and Brad Boxberger.
So, in a one-week period Jocketty has acquired two players in exchange for seven players, five of whom are minor-league prospects.
THAT SEEMS TO BE a n indication that Jocketty and the Reds are trying to load up for a 2012 run at the National League Central title. That seems a legitimate move judging from what has happened within the division.
The St. Louis Cardinals have lost Albert Pujols and it appears that Milwaukee first baseman Prince Fielder is headed out of the division as a free agent. The Cardinals, though, did sign free agent Carlos Beltran on Thursday.
When the Reds acquired Latos for their rotation, they snapped up a pitcher who will be under their control for the next four years. Not so with Marshall. He is in his third year of arbitration eligibility and can become a free agent after this season, during which the Reds will pay him $3.1 million.
“I have a good relationship with his representative, (agent) Barry Meister),” said Jocketty. “There are no guarantees, but we’ll sure try to sign him to a long-term deal. We hope he’ll come in and see what a great team and organization we have and will want to stay.”
ASKED IF HIS CARDS are sufficient enough to go all in, Jocketty said, “We try to win every year, tried to win this year. We can’t do things through free agency so we have to do it through trades. That’s why we develop players. We either fit them into our team or use them to make trades.
“You hate to trade young players and hate to call them and tell them they’ve been traded,” he said. “But in the case of Sean Marshall, he was one of the top left-handed relief pitchers in the game and he can certainly help us win next year.”
While Marshall was primarily a set-up guy for the Cubs, look for him to be in the mix to become the team’s closer.
“That’s a possibility,” said Jocketty. “We’re still talking to Francisco Cordero, but if that doesn’t work out, we have people already on our club who can compete for it and Sean certainly would be included.”
That suits Marshall.
“I had a couple of opportunities last year when Carlos Marmol struggled,” he said. “I took the ball and really enjoyed it. I was very comfortable in the closing role.”
MARSHALL, 29 and 6-7 220 pounds, was a set-up man for Marmol last year and appeared in 78 games (75 2/3 innings), going 6-6 with a 2.26 ERA.
He also finished 18 games and had five saves while walking 17 and striking out 79. Amazingly, pitching in the tight quarters that is Wrigley Field, Marshall gave up only one home run all year.
“I was surprised by the trade, but I understand the business,” said Marshall, the Cubs’ sixth-round draft pick in 2003. “It will be an adjustment, but I know with the great players they have we have a chance to win and I hope I can help them win a World Series ring.”
Jocketty knows that Reds’ left-handed hitters like Joey Votto and Jay Bruce came back to the dugout mumbling after trying to make solid contract against Marshall, but he was equally effective against right-handers, too. Ask Brandon Phillips. Or Drew Stubbs.
“When we can’t figure out how to hit a pitcher, we try to acquire him,” said Jocketty with a laugh.
Wood, 24, was 6-6 with a 4.84 ERA in 18 appearances for the Reds last year and made four bullpen appearances. He began last season as the team’s No. 2 starter behind Volquez (also traded) and struggled enough that the team sent him to Class AAA Louiville for a significant portion of the season.
OUTFIELDER SAPPELT, 24, was a spring sensation, hitting over .500, but didn’t make the team until later in the season. He was eventually called up to be part of the revolving door that was left field and hit .243 in 38 games.
Infielder Torreyes is only 19, a free agent signed out of Venezuela was a mini-mite0000. He is listed as 5-10, but is closer to 5-5. He played his first full professional season at Class A Dayton, where he hit .356 in 67 games.
The Reds acquired another pitcher on Friday when they claimed right-hander Josh Judy off waivers from the Cleveland Indians.
Judy, 25, was a 38th-round draft pick by the Tribe in 2007 and made his major-league debut last year, appearing in 12 games over 14 innings. He was 0-0 with a 7.07 ERA and gave up 18 hits, four of them home runs.
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By Mike Marelli
January 5, 2012 6:26 AM | Link to this
Whether Larue had 20 or 2000 concussions prior to Cueto’s kicking him in the head with steel tipped spikes, is 100% immaterial. It’s a cop out lame attempt excuse by you, in an attempt to justify Cueto’s criminal act. Bottom line, Cueto’s actions caused the final and most severe concussion of Larue’s career, which then subsequently led to Larue’s retirement. And it’s only by the good graces of Larue’s heart, showing the class person he is, that he does not seek a legal civil remedy vs. Cueto. Only a fool like you, would attempt to justify the reprehensible behavior of one player kicking another. The Cardinal club basically was not hurt very much when Larue was lost, so I’m not as you say his “avenging angel”. But he still was a decent teammate, and we won’t mind beating your butts again in 2012, just as we did you and the rest of the league 2011. And I’m also telling you I know Carpenter, he and Larue were close friends. Carp has not forgotten, about this situation. The heat was simply too thick to retaliate last season. But payback is coming, and it can take the form of many years to settle the account. You can file that under clairvoyant predictions for 2012, or if you prefer, you can just jam it.
By DD
January 3, 2012 11:56 AM | Link to this
Good discussion, BG. We’ll just have to agree to disagree - especially defensively with regards to Stubbs vs. Heisey. While neither is great, I see Stubbs above average and Heisey just average. I do think we’ll see a different approach with Stubbs at the plate this year. Or, maybe it’s just wishful thinking. Getting Piere in Cincinnati would be a great addition regardless. And Marelli…you’re still a whiney loser.
By DtM
January 3, 2012 8:29 AM | Link to this
@M Marelli: LaRue estimates he has had “close to 20” concussions in his athletic career extending back to high school football, so to blame Cueto for being the accidental cause for last one is misplaced when LaRue himself states: “All it takes is a foul ball to the head. Even as a backup that happened [three to five] times last year. It’s not a question of if it would happen again, it’s when.” So get informed before you troll and stop acting like LaRue’s avenging angel.
By Mike Marelli
January 3, 2012 6:55 AM | Link to this
The Cardinals are going to go “all in” the Reds behinds with their boots. Cueto and Phillips are still owed an a*s beating for their BS. In Cueto’s case, if you believe Chris Carpenter has forgotten about Cueto’s kick to Larue’s head, ending Larue’s career, you’re sadly mistaken. Payback is a mother, and can take years to accomplish.
By BG
January 1, 2012 12:54 PM | Link to this
Well,you make some good points here; however, I maintain that Heisey is cheap, has not yet been given a full opportunity to play as a regular,and cannot be dismissed until he has that playing time, and the money for another LF could be used to resign Cordero.Heisey is much better than Gomes, defensively, and is more than equal to Stubbs, who still shows weaknesses in playing defense. Doesn’t matter where he was drafted if he can’t make the plays that Juan P. makes and many others, including Heisey.The Reds would be stronger with Juan P in center and Heisey in left, than having Stubbs strike out all year, as well.Plus, we’d have our leadoff man in Juan P.I don’t keep the stats you like to propose, I just look at talent. Heisey has more talent and grit than Stubbs.His one strikeout per game, ain’t as bad as Stubbs 200 plus farse.Stubbs is trade bait.
By DD
January 1, 2012 9:18 AM | Link to this
Awkward percentages like he’s a .234 hitter as a starter with more than 1 strike out a game? Don’t know what’s awkward about that. As for Jocketty’s FA signings…Gonzalez played here in 2007 while Jocketty arrived in 2008. How is that his responsibility? Gomes…you forget we got him cheap and his first two seasons he hit 20 and 18 HRs with averages of .266 and .267. Not bad. You’re right on Taveras and Patterson - didn’t work out. But, a mid-market franchise can’t spend big $ on FAs. As a result, you’re going to hit on some and miss on others. Walt’s big trade for Rolen worked out, didn’t it? Hopefully this year’s trades will as well. As for Stubbs…I’m not a huge fan of his although I see a much better defender than Heisey and is faster. Even though he Ks more than anyone’s liking, I can understand why he is getting ample opportunities. He was a #1 draft pick! You don’t let a guy you have a ton invested in to walk after his 2nd full MLB season when he with .255 with 22 HRs and 30 SB his rookie year. I’m glad Heisey is here. He’s a great hitter off the bench. I just want someone to compete with him for the starting job. If he wins out, fine. But, he’s done nothing to have the job handed to him.
By BG
December 31, 2011 5:03 PM | Link to this
You spew awkward percentages DD. Most of the comments I read hear are in favor of Heisey playing Left field for the Reds this year. Seems to me that Jocketty and Baker have been making some bad choices for a few years about who is brought in to play as regulars for Cincy, namely Patterson and Taveras and Gonzales and Gomes. I’d say it’s about time to take a good look at the ‘forest’behind the trees…know what I mean? Time to play Heisey all year every day. So say many others who disagree with many of Jocketty’s previous moves. A full year of Heisey will produce better results than Stubbs.
By Mike Marelli
December 31, 2011 2:26 AM | Link to this
Happy New Year Reds. Just know we’re already looking forward to baseball and spanking that a*s again. Sincerely, The Eleven Time World Champion St. Louis Cardinals. P.S. We got #11 in 2011, so it makes sense to get @12 in 2012, Can You Dig It?
By redsfandownunder
December 30, 2011 1:53 PM | Link to this
It sure looks like Walt is all in 2012. Who wants the GM job in 2014 when Votto, Cueto, Marshall, etc. are gone and we have no Alonso, Boxberger or Grandal to replace them???? What worries me is that Walt doesn’t give a crap about the Reds in 2 years because he’ll be retired and he’ll just leave it to someone else to clean up the mess. Anything short of a World Series appearance in the next 2 years, then these moves will be a major major major bust. Yes - the Reds are all in for 2012/2013. I’m going to enjoy every minute of the next 2 years….and possibly look to find an new obsession in 2014 because it’s going to get ugly down the line folks.
By Mike Mc in Ky
December 30, 2011 2:01 AM | Link to this
Happy holidays everyone! Walt sat in the porta-potty for 2 yrs after the Rolen trade before he”Gave up the farm” to get a frontline starter, and 3 guys for a lh pitcher who likely will NOT sign an extension unless we end up winning the division this coming year! That makes no sense when Walt was quoted as saying that everyone wanted too many young players in the winter meetings to get Jiar or Geo, also good pitchers! But I still agree that unless Todd or Chris can stop striking out at a Stubbs rate n hitting above 250, and drive in 90 to 100 plus rbis, you’d better get a right handed PROVEN bat to help Joey or he will for sure take off after this season! Cozart will be a whole helluva lot than Paul or Edgar was, wait n see. But I don’t think Rolen can play more than 110 games tops with his age and durability, and swing away Juan F is another free swinger with a” I can’t take a walk” attitude at the plate. His numbers will tell you all that. Theriot would be a solid backup for the infield. Go Reds! Go Hal!
By Yippee
December 28, 2011 2:43 PM | Link to this
It’s about time! The Reds are finally in a position to cash in chips and go for it. How long have Reds fans been waiting for ownership/management to make some aggressive moves to put the Reds in position to win NOW? 2012 is the year, Reds win the division and make a play for the World Series.
By michael in Singapore
December 28, 2011 2:41 PM | Link to this
I’m glad the Reds are focused on pitching…but I’m bummed we lost Sappelt. I think the kid can be a legitimate player if given an opportunity. Overall, I think the Reds gave up too much in their trades but we’ll see.
By vivian
December 28, 2011 10:58 AM | Link to this
Judy was a 34th Round draft pick, NOT a 38th.
By victor
December 28, 2011 10:57 AM | Link to this
Judy was a 34th Round draft pick, NOT a 38th.
By Mike n Bvrcrk
December 27, 2011 11:22 AM | Link to this
Foolish me - I was sure the Heisey Love Shack was vacant until spring training! I have no idea what the outfield will look like - other than Bruce, but pretty certain a 500+ K total, will get the Reds a strong bottom rung finish! A Stubbs, Heisey combo cannot happen, unless BOTH show improvement in Ari. Right or wrong, think the Reds will stick with Stubbs to start the season. Looking for anither LF option makes sense to me.
By DD
December 27, 2011 7:58 AM | Link to this
Spewing nonsense? What did say that offended you so much, BG? That I personally don’t think Heisey is the answer? Sorry, Mr. Sensitive. I forgot the Jocketty himself has also said he’s looking for a LF. And, so has 90% of the baseball world when discussing the Reds needs. I wish he would be the answer. But not many out there think he is outside of his apologists….aka you.
By BG
December 26, 2011 11:56 PM | Link to this
You’ll never get a more reasonable price than Heisey in left field this year,DD. Unlike Mr. No bunt Stubbs, and never know what to expect, in the clutch,J. Bruce, who have had a number of full seasons as starters, Mr. Heisey has yet to have that luxury. So, how about rooting for him instead of spewing nonsense, when he has yet to get the same opportunity as the afore mentioned,and Gomes and Patterson,Taveras and, Oh so many others, have been afforded?
By Ridnaway
December 26, 2011 8:20 PM | Link to this
Walt already let Josh Willingham slide to the Twins while pursuing Latos. Why was that an either-or situation? Can he not carry on more than one task at a time? The Reds need a RH hitter in the #4 hole so Votto can see another fastball in the zone before becoming a Marlin or worse, a Cardinal. Meanwhile Stubbs, the fastest player in baseball from the dugout to home plate and back still has a job…. go figure.
By StuttgartTim
December 26, 2011 6:26 PM | Link to this
A quick look shows that Wood had a better ERA over the last 2 years than Bailey, and we had control of him for 5 more years. When you have a lefty starter who has had some success I think you have to get a lot for him. Marshall is unquestionably a good pitcher, but hey the Cubs could have him back in a year. I would NOT have made this deal without an extension. Even then, we’re trading a Starter for a middle reliever AND throwing in 2 prospects? Marshall is the better “P” right now. In a few years??? You say “going all in” Hal to me it’s almost like he knows the world will end after this season, or at least that there will be no baseball after 2012. As you say we have now given up 7 for 2. You also say 5 are prospects, and maybe NONE will pan out, but odds are at least a couple will.
By GG
December 26, 2011 1:25 AM | Link to this
Time will tell on these two recent trades, but my initial thought was that the Reds played Santa Claus and gave them away. Yeah the farm system is “rich” but seems we gave alot. Time will tell on what we received. Here’s hoping Walt hasn’t lost his touch. And in ANY season, pray we don’t get cut down by injuries!
By AP-FLORIDA
December 25, 2011 5:22 PM | Link to this
Hope u r correct Rick- trick is getting Dusty to do his job.
By Rick
December 25, 2011 3:05 PM | Link to this
I have said it before and I will say it again, give Walt a chance, he built winners in St. Louis without the big name studs (minus Albert) he can do it in Cincinnati!!! He just needs a manager to put his foot down and make these young players play TEAM baseball instead of individual selfish baseball…Make Stubbs learn how to bunt to utilize his speed, hit & run, small ball, maximize the talent you have!!! You can never have enough good young arms… Do this and the Redlegs will be successful in 2012…
By bobmc
December 24, 2011 11:37 PM | Link to this
Please don’t mention J. D. Drew. The trades were only fair. If Votto goes unsigned, they lost a potentially great 1st baseman in Alonso. I predicted and still do that Travis Woods has the tools to be a left-handed Greg Maddux. Go with Marshall and please don’t resign Cordero. He was more lucky than good in ‘11.
By Harry the Horse
December 24, 2011 2:43 PM | Link to this
Reds still need a lead-off man and a closer. Coco Crisp?? and Coco Cordero returning? Cordero’s agent is asking for a ton of money and have been turned down already by some teams so maybe he will come back to Cincy.
By Slag
December 24, 2011 10:06 AM | Link to this
You people slamming the players like Wood and Sappelt are clueless. Many many trades, like these two the reds made, have absolutely nothing to do with not liking those players but more to do with getting other players in there for real needs. Latos is a top of a rotation pitcher and I’ve been personally clammoring to get another batman, or Robin, to join Cueto. This team has never ever had 2 top guys like this in their rotation. They also do not have either a closer or adequate set-up guy but they do now however they use Marshall. Next on the list is probably getting Quintin from the white sox or omebody
By Dusty
December 24, 2011 9:30 AM | Link to this
Still missing: (a) Left fielder who can hit better than .250 and catch fly balls, (b) shortstop who knows what a bat is for, (c) third baseman who can last more than 30 days into the season.
By Cat Slobber
December 24, 2011 9:04 AM | Link to this
Of course they’re going all in. They lose Votto after next year so it’s now or never. When you have the worst staff ERA in the central division you have to try and do something even if it’s not enough.
By AP-FLORIDA
December 24, 2011 9:04 AM | Link to this
Hey, have not read column much lately, and again today there is no mention of Dusty. Do we still have him? We do !! Aw shucks. Merry Christmas everyone, you too Dusty!!!!!!
By Randyman1956
December 24, 2011 4:50 AM | Link to this
Give these trades a chance. There’s no where to go but up. Merry Christmas Everyone.
By null
December 23, 2011 9:58 PM | Link to this
I don’t think I would have used the striking out Stubbs comment as an argument of how good someone’s pitching is. If that was the case, every pitcher in the majors would be considered good.
By larsbenders
December 23, 2011 9:30 PM | Link to this
What does it say when the number 1 and 2 starters from last year are traded away? Maybe someone severely misjudged talent? Maybe someone still is?
By Lars Benders
December 23, 2011 9:29 PM | Link to this
What does it say when the number 1 and 2 starters from last year are traded away? Maybe someone severely misjudged talent? Maybe someone still is?
By Lars Benders
December 23, 2011 9:28 PM | Link to this
What does it say when the number 1 and 2 starters from last year are traded away? Maybe someone severely misjudged talent? Maybe someone still is?
By Lars Benders
December 23, 2011 9:27 PM | Link to this
What does it say when the number 1 and 2 starters from last year are traded away? Maybe someone severely misjudged talent? Maybe someone still is?
By jimi
December 23, 2011 8:45 PM | Link to this
The only player that I have seen go in the trades that will be missed is Alonso, go Reds.
By DD
December 23, 2011 8:35 PM | Link to this
Either you’re always building for the future (what’s the point?) or you go all in when you have the chance. Is there a better time than when the two teams ahead of you lose their best hitters? Plenty of FA outfielders still available to bring in to compete with Heisey (who I don’t believe is the answer - time will tell). J.D. Drew, Ankiel, Juan Piere (next year’s leadoff?), Luke Scott, Ludwick, Ross, or Fukudome could all be had at a reasonable price. Or, if you’re really “going for it” Bob, you could sign Maglio Ordonez (moving Bruce to LF) or Vladimir Guerrero (maybe he could still play the OF?). Both still have plenty in their bats. It’s going to be an exciting year!
By gom
December 23, 2011 8:13 PM | Link to this
liked watching Torreyes hit and run the bases but he is very, very small. Can’t see him as a major leaguer until the “size is everything” mentality leaves baseball. But he was fun to watch in Dayton. Sappelt, like Alonso, fell out of favor late in the year, so no surprise there. Wood was awful last year just like Volquez so he was goner. I guess the question for Volquez and Wood is are they actually awful or did the Reds mis-handle them and make them awful? Hope we find a proven outfielder and 3rd baseman soon or the all out for 2012 plan remains flawed.
By nut ball
December 23, 2011 7:14 PM | Link to this
I SEE WALT TRING TO SAIL THE REDS TEAM DOWN THE OHIO RIVER.hEY WALT ST.LOUIS ALREADY LET THE BEST GO.SO WHY NOT TRY TO BUILD A TRUE WINNER IN cinncinnati?we need a true short stop.and someone to protect votto too.how about trying a little harder,
By Tom
December 23, 2011 6:19 PM | Link to this
It’s nice to see the Reds shift gears from building mode to win mode. Now, either Walt goes with Heisey or else he acquires another left fielder.
By bruce
December 23, 2011 5:43 PM | Link to this
Nice to have pitching. Hope we have someone to drive in a couple runs besides Votto.